"ttyymmnn" (ttyymmnn)
07/03/2017 at 09:39 • Filed to: planelopnik
3
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"ttyymmnn" (ttyymmnn)
07/03/2017 at 09:39 • Filed to: planelopnik | 3
| 22 |
As we approach the four-year anniversary of the crash of Asiana Flight 214 at San Francisco, security camera footage of the entire accident has become available. The airliner approaches runway 28L from the top right corner of the video.
The Boeing 777 came in too low and its tail struck the seawall short of the runway. As the plane cartwheeled to a stop, three flight attendants seated in the back of the plane were ejected from the aircraft while still strapped to their seats. Three passengers were killed, including a young woman who was run over by a fire engine that had responded to the crash. Of the 307 passengers and crew, 187 were injured, 49 seriously. It was the first crash of a 777 in its 21 years of service.
While placing a portion of the blame on Boeing for not adequately describing the function of the 777's automated systems, the majority of blame was placed on the pilots and Asiana’s flight training.
The National Transportation Safety Board determines that the probable cause of this accident was the flight crew’s mismanagement of the airplane’s descent during the visual approach, the pilot flying’s unintended deactivation of automatic airspeed control, the flight crew’s inadequate monitoring of airspeed, and the flight crew’s delayed execution of a go-around after they became aware that the airplane was below acceptable glidepath and airspeed tolerances. Contributing to the accident were (1) the complexities of the autothrottle and autopilot flight director systems that were inadequately described in Boeing’s documentation and Asiana’s pilot training, which increased the likelihood of mode error; (2) the flight crew’s nonstandard communication and coordination regarding the use of the autothrottle and autopilot flight director systems; (3) the pilot flying’s inadequate training on the planning and executing of visual approaches; (4) the pilot monitoring/instructor pilot’s inadequate supervision of the pilot flying; and (5) flight crew fatigue, which likely degraded their performance. !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! :129
A recording of the tower communications can be heard here.
E90M3
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 09:54 |
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You mean 4 year anniversary?
Also I’m still surprised that a TV station broadcast this:
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ttyymmnn
> E90M3
07/03/2017 at 10:02 |
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Yes. In the future, or at least for today, please add 3 to any number I post. Except for that one. That would make it 6, and that’s not right. Also, don’t add 3 to the 6 because then that would be 9, and then you’d have to subtract 6.
pip bip - choose Corrour
> E90M3
07/03/2017 at 10:03 |
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i thought it was longer than a year too.
Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> E90M3
07/03/2017 at 10:08 |
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I’d forgotten about that bit of the story. Not a proud moment for the human race.
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Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:10 |
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There was a brouhaha about the fire response and cameras worn by the responders. I flew into SFO not long after that event and could see the black spot where the incident took place. Last week, when I flew into SFO, I could not tell that anything had taken place there.
facw
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:10 |
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I’m still amazed by the pilots here, when they realized something was wrong, they apparently pulled back in the yoke, nosing up and making the situation worse. I feel like one of the first things pilots are taught is to use throttle to control altitude and pitch to control airspeed right? But these guys didn’t know that (at least not well enough to not to do a panic move), and also didn’t understand the autopilot modes, which really makes you wonder what did they know? Would the passengers have been any worse off with one of those fake airline pilots India’s had problems with?
fhrblig
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:14 |
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ttyymmnn
> facw
07/03/2017 at 10:19 |
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I haven’t read the NTSB report in any detail, but the sense I get is that many of these pilots (I’m not calling out just Asian pilots) are basically trained to fly these planes on auto. When the shit hits the fan, they don’t have the seat-of-your-pants flying skills necessary.
It was also an interesting mix of crew. The captain had just 43 hours in the 777 and he was making his first landing at SFO. The right seat was another captain who had 3,220 hours in the 777 and was acting as instructor. It was his first flight in this role, and he was also the pilot in command. It was the first time the two had flown together. So who knows what was going on in the cockpit, whether the instructor was actually instructing, and was in a position to take command when required. There might be cultural difficulties with one captain telling another captain what to do, particularly if you are inexperienced as an instructor. At the end of the day, there was nobody flying the plane.
!!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!
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Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:25 |
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From the NTSB finding, it’s apparent that the pilot(s) didn’t know how to operate the equipment they were flying. Inexcusable.
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ttyymmnn
> fhrblig
07/03/2017 at 10:25 |
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Once again, it has been shown that any comment on Oppo can be replied to with a Monty Python reference.
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ttyymmnn
> pip bip - choose Corrour
07/03/2017 at 10:27 |
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I haven’t had all my coffee yet today.
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ttyymmnn
> Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
07/03/2017 at 10:30 |
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I watched a video about the firefighters running over the crash victim. When the engines first arrived, a firefighter was standing next to the victim and signaled for the driver to avoid her. Later, the ground became covered with foam and the victim was obscured. She was run over twice. I still don’t know why they never moved her.
Thomas Donohue
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:34 |
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Amazing that it somehow landed belly-up after the cartwheel...very lucky that there weren’t more fatalities.
Unfortunately, my most vivid memory is all of the passengers that exited with luggage and shopping bags/duty free in their hands. Made me sick.
Meanwhile, others chose to carry injured human beings on their backs instead of personal belongings. Made me feel good about humanity.
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Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:35 |
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I’d classify that as malpractice.
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Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 10:36 |
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Gross malpractice.
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ttyymmnn
> Thomas Donohue
07/03/2017 at 10:39 |
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Gotta stop for pictures, too.
And update your Facebook.
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Thomas Donohue
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 11:44 |
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I was looking for that top pic, but only because it showed the two women as if they were walking down the street after shopping.
While taking pictures and selfies after exiting the plane is questionable, at least you aren’t impeding someone’s safe exit from the burning plane while you grab your shit from the overhead compartment.
John Norris (AngryDrifter)
> ttyymmnn
07/03/2017 at 22:39 |
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So I learned two things from watching this. I was familiar with the crash, I know the airport and approach and being in the aviation industry I always pay attention to these tragic events. Thanks for posting this.
#1. The slides are known to bust people up. They have to be steep enough to get people out fast but shallow enough to not get a stack of busted up bodies at the bottom. But they have a reputation for the later. Of course with the nose gear and mains busted off the airplane was much lower and the slides then much shallower. An obvious result but not one I thought about when the event occurred. Watching the video it is amazing how slow the evacuation of the aircraft was. Even with the large opening from the empennage busting off it took a long time for everyone to get out. People were struggling to get down the slide. There is certainly room for improvement as having landing gear sheer off for a crash like this is at least a reasonable probability.
#2. The fire was almost out, or so it seemed, before it really started raging. Not sure if they stopped prematurely, or they ran out of retardant and water in some of the trucks. Either way it was a total failure on the SFO fire department. Not only did they run someone over but there easily could have been injured stuck on board that couldn’t get off and would have burned as a result of their failure to get the fire out. As someone else pointed out on this thread the passengers are lucky the plane rested in a semi normal position. If it had ended up flipped the egress would have been worse and there probably would have been even more injuries. And there probably would have been some stuck and burned to death as a result of the fire kicking back up.
Hopefully the failures here are getting adequately communicated to every airport fire department and similar shortfalls that may exist at other airports are being addressed. Building fires happen all the time and therefore the “what to do” and”what not do” were established long ago. There just aren’t that many aircraft fires. In a little over 100 years the aviation industry has made great progress in safety. The fire fighting mistakes here are very disappointing. That industry has some work to do. Their best path forward is to be completely open, accept the failures and get everyone to learn from them.
Also as someone else pointed out, us passengers could learn a bit to. Just leave the baggage on board. If you rescued your precious belongings but someone died as a result of you not getting out of the way you might be carrying some serious baggage for the rest of your life.
gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
> ttyymmnn
07/04/2017 at 22:35 |
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can’t beleive its already been 4 years. A co-worker used to have interestig conspiracy theory, and by interesting completely batshit insane.
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ttyymmnn
> John Norris (AngryDrifter)
07/06/2017 at 11:47 |
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For some unknown reason, the captain delayed the evacuation order for 90 seconds. It wasn’t until an FA reported fire outside the aircraft that the evacuation started. Had the fire spread faster, those 90 seconds could have been disastrous.
It also looks like a single fire truck got to the scene first, then it was some time before the rest arrived. I think I counted 3-4 minutes before first responders got there. I don’t know what their response time is supposed to be, but it felt like a long time.
Passengers will always take their crap, and not care if they killed somebody for it.
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John Norris (AngryDrifter)
> ttyymmnn
07/06/2017 at 22:51 |
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For some unknown reason, the captain delayed the evacuation order for 90 seconds.
I suppose he might have been regaining his consciousness, or at least collecting his wits. That fuselage was whipping around pretty good.
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ttyymmnn
> John Norris (AngryDrifter)
07/06/2017 at 22:56 |
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It would be interesting to go back and listen to the tower recording and see how long it was between the plane coming to a stop and the first contact with the cockpit crew.